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  • Winchester Victory

    A current issue of a popular magazine remembers Operation Overload and it's weapons. One thing that is mentioned is 30-06 M2 ammo. The original is a 150grFB round for the M1Garand. They experimented with the 172 gr. but cancelled the experiments. Anybody know why it was dropped ? The author says the current manufactured Winchester Victory load, complete with the exact copy of original 150gr bullet, is using a slow burning powder and that it is not recommended for the M-1 Garand as it used 10gr more of a slower burning powder. The slow burning powder load can over-drive the operating rod thus damaging it. The correct load is 10gr less of a faster powder.

    O.K., nobody is going to guess why the 172gr was being dropped and the 150 adapted. The 172gr exceeded the 'safety zone' of all the military ranges at the time so the round was dropped.
    The dimpling is usually by excess lubricant while full length re sizing and is pushed out when firing with no negative results.
    You are right, LC brass is slightly heavier and therefore has a smaller case capacity so the same powder charge as commercial brass will result in higher pressure in the military.
    I have loaded tens of thousands of rounds of various calibers and have never, ever annealed a case neck. When I get my 10,12 or 15 load I simply scrap the brass. Yes, I keep track of each lot of brass I have for each caliber for count, times loaded and times trimmed and load data for each load.
    Last edited by jhjimbo; 06-08-2019, 05:30 PM.

  • #2
    Originally posted by jhjimbo View Post
    A current issue of a popular magazine remembers Operation Overload and it's weapons. One thing that is mentioned is 30-06 M2 ammo. The original is a 150grFB round for the M1Garand. They experimented with the 172 gr. but cancelled the experiments. Anybody know why it was dropped ? The author says the current manufactured Winchester Victory load, complete with the exact copy of original 150gr bullet, is using a slow burning powder and that it is not recommended for the M-1 Garand as it used 10gr more of a slower burning powder. The slow burning powder load can over-drive the operating rod thus damaging it. The correct load is 10gr less of a faster powder.
    Last fall my brother gave me a couple of boxes of military 30-06 ammo from WWII complete with stripper clips. He has a couple dozen other boxes. Those bullets sure look longer than 150 grains. Guess I can pull one and weigh it. Five rounds shot a very tight group after I zeroed it with factory ammo ... but almost off the paper on lower left hand corner at 100 yards. Very strange.

    I have read one needs to use caution if reloading that brass. It is a lot thicker than current factory stuff and therefore the firing chamber is more compressed. Consequently one can expect military brass to pattern differently when using the same powder and bullet load in commercial brass. Also I have found the military stuff can be tricky to size without dimpling the neck, presumably because the thicker brass is not as malleable. A dimple in the neck would also change the firing chamber dimensions.
    Last edited by Ontario Honker Hunter; 06-08-2019, 09:24 AM.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Ontario Honker Hunter View Post

      ..... I have found the military stuff can be tricky to size without dimpling the neck, presumably because the thicker brass is not as malleable. A dimple in the neck would also change the firing chamber dimensions.
      In my experience, neck (shoulder?) dimpling is most often caused by excessive case lube.
      I've "dimpled" quite a few in my time. I've never noticed any difference in the performance of rounds with/without dimpling on the shoulder, nor have I "noted" any difference in "case life" of dimpled cases.
      ...but then, I don't have all the lab equipment and tools needed to measure pressure differences.

      BTW! My favorite brass, when I can get my hands on it, is "Lake City". Military brass head stamped "LC".
      "Good stuff, Maynard!"

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