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  • FirstBubba
    replied
    Originally posted by Ontario Honker Hunter View Post

    Yeah, and I understand mousetraps are also now legal for taking little Texas whitetails.
    And you think putting bad produce on the floor of a grocery store is a good idea.

    Go peddle your papers elsewhere.
    You've never even seen a Texas whitetail.

    Any animal on the North American continent can be killed with a simple .22LR.
    Again, bullet placement dingle berry, NOT bore diameter.

    Leave a comment:


  • crm3006
    replied
    honk thephony: Yeah, and I understand mousetraps are also now legal for taking little Texas whitetails.

    Regardless of the worthless input from the great know-nothing of the North, I like to use what the rifle likes. I have one '06 that likes hot 165 grs., and tends to spit anything else. Nosler Ballistic Tips or Hornady SSTs shoot about the same at 200. yds. Another '06 likes 150 gr, but will shoot anything good enough to kill deer out to 200 yds.
    The .25-06 rainy day rifle likes either 117 or 115 gr., again, NBTs or SSTs.
    All of this to say, find what the rifle likes, and stay with it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ontario Honker Hunter
    replied
    Originally posted by FirstBubba View Post
    I like a 150 SPBT in my AR10 .308. I've seen deer shot with both 150's and 180's in an '06. The 180 is far superior.
    I agree with D'Man, the '06 is way over kill for whitetails....but then, aren't most of the center fire rifles we "hunt" with?
    Geez, a well placed .223 will do the job.
    Yeah, and I understand mousetraps are also now legal for taking little Texas whitetails.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sarge01
    replied
    I shoot either Nosler Accubonds or Hornady SST's in my .308 and my 300WSM. I don't shoot anything heavier than 165 grain bullets. I have had no problem killing deer with either bullet.

    Leave a comment:


  • FirstBubba
    replied
    I like a 150 SPBT in my AR10 .308. I've seen deer shot with both 150's and 180's in an '06. The 180 is far superior.
    I agree with D'Man, the '06 is way over kill for whitetails....but then, aren't most of the center fire rifles we "hunt" with?
    Geez, a well placed .223 will do the job.

    Leave a comment:


  • dewman
    replied
    I just bought 2 boxes 150 grain Hornady American whitetail, shot 9 of them, so I guess I'm fixing to find out. I like Fusions & last year the 120 Nosler ballistic tips for my 7-08. Used core-lokts in my 7Rmag (175 gr) for elk, they worked well. Seen about every make & model out there used on deer, never seen a bad one,if, the bullet was made for deer. Did see a Winchester Deer Season xp (black tip), I believe 150gr., in a 300wsm wreck a Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1763.JPG
Views:	267
Size:	696.8 KB
ID:	740814 deer from stem to stern.(nasty)

    Leave a comment:


  • rock rat
    replied
    core lokt or Hornady American whitetail
    I'd go core lokt if given those two choices. I used to use core lokts and they are very consistent and not overly technical.

    It wasn't with Hornady Whitetail but with a much more famous controlled expansion premium bullet that I had one expand before it ever got in. The ribs behind the fore leg were a mess but with no entrance hole. 180 grain. The elk turned around and I ran up on it from the side and put another in it, and a third when it turned around, and I ran closer and put one in the brain stem. Thought I was going to have to beat the thing with my empty rifle.

    When I butchered it I found no entrance or exit holes like I normally do in the rib cage but some of the fragments did make it through and into the lungs but with little damage. The third shot was in back of the ribs quartering away some of it went up into the vitals mostly liver. No exit from any of them.

    My kid shot a small deer with the 243 and a Berger bullet (100 grain)and it dropped so fast I didn't see it, thought it ran off, looked all around and found it 6 feet from where it was shot, a lot of the lungs and huge blood vessels or whatever blown out the backside. I figure immediate total loss of blood pressure.

    Fancy bullets work great when they work, but I'd go for consistency over fancy. Accuracy doesn't matter to me, I don't shoot over 200 yards.

    I shoot Barnes 180s in everything. Instantly double in size and exit is same size as entrance when viewing the rib cage. Almost 100% weight retention. I retrieved one and weighed it but that's another story.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ontario Honker Hunter
    replied
    Originally posted by DakotaMan View Post
    Honker: "Not so much in 180 gr." Good point honker... I agree, the 180s don't seem to damage as much meat as the lighter 30-06 bullets. They also don't seem to create as much shock on impact. Don't get me wrong... a 30-06 is way overkill for any deer with any bullet that exits the muzzle; but I have seen a few strange things from the 180s over the years.

    For example,I jumped a button buck and he ran 30 yards from my friend who was blocking a short distance ahead. He hit right in the vitals with his 180g 30-06. I saw a cloud of atomized blood on the far side of the little buck. He never fell though and just put it in high gear. I watched him for a quarter of a mile as he disappeared over a knoll in the distance. As I passed where the shot occurred, I saw his heart and both lungs hanging in the bushes. We found him dead some 300 yards away. I've never seen anything quite like that one.

    With another big buck, I saw a hit to the center of the chest. It rolled the brute but he quickly jumped to his feet and I chased him a couple of miles before he finally dropped.

    Both of these were 180g bullets that were quite fatal but didn't seem to shock the animals enough to keep them down.

    I actually shoot 165g bullets for deer and with a center fire rifle, and that seems to be a favorable tradeoff between speed and meat damage. I always aim high behind the shoulder to save meat regardless of caliber. I definitely favor the 25-06 for putting deer down fast but you have to respect the good old 30-06 with any bullet.
    Well, that is quite extraordinary. First, it is hard to believe a 180 gr 30-06 would blow the heart and lungs out of a deer even if shot at ten yards. Unless maybe the bullet was hollow point ammo and loaded up to 3,000 fps (and the gun didn't blow up before the deer did). Not sure anyone even makes 180 gr HP. And I have my doubts that even a hollow point would do that kind of damage. I have shot plenty (scores) of deer through the heart with 180 gr PSP and, yes, they often jump and run like hell before piling up but furthermost I've seen is fifty yards downhill. A lot less if anything gets in their way like a tree or sagebrush.

    The 165 gr specialty bullets I loaded this past year seemed to produce interesting results re meat damage ... as far as I could tell anyway ... which wasn't far. The Nosler Partitions I used in Africa flattened everything on the spot except gemsbuck and she was obviously dead on her feet after the first shot. She is the only animal I saw skinned and the damage from two hits through the heart didn't look extraordinary given that the range was nearly point blank. Very surprising. Wildebeest probably was not too badly damaged. We found the bottom half of the bullet hanging in the hide on exit side. That shoulder may have been messed up. I did skin the deer shot in Montana with 165 Barnes TSX at about 65 yards. Appeared to be almost no damage but it was hit in a spot ahead of the front quarter at base of neck that really shouldn't produce any. The butcher claimed there was a lot of bloodshot but I kinda wonder about that. Sometimes it is hidden beneath the surface if there's internal bone impact but that should not have happened with this buck. Some bones may have been hit but not large ones. I think the old fella was maybe bragging himself up for a tip.

    Leave a comment:


  • Amflyer
    replied
    . saw his heart and both lungs hanging in the bushes

    Sounds legit.

    Leave a comment:


  • DakotaMan
    replied
    Honker: "Not so much in 180 gr." Good point honker... I agree, the 180s don't seem to damage as much meat as the lighter 30-06 bullets. They also don't seem to create as much shock on impact. Don't get me wrong... a 30-06 is way overkill for any deer with any bullet that exits the muzzle; but I have seen a few strange things from the 180s over the years.

    For example,I jumped a button buck and he ran 30 yards from my friend who was blocking a short distance ahead. He hit right in the vitals with his 180g 30-06. I saw a cloud of atomized blood on the far side of the little buck. He never fell though and just put it in high gear. I watched him for a quarter of a mile as he disappeared over a knoll in the distance. As I passed where the shot occurred, I saw his heart and both lungs hanging in the bushes. We found him dead some 300 yards away. I've never seen anything quite like that one.

    With another big buck, I saw a hit to the center of the chest. It rolled the brute but he quickly jumped to his feet and I chased him a couple of miles before he finally dropped.

    Both of these were 180g bullets that were quite fatal but didn't seem to shock the animals enough to keep them down.

    I actually shoot 165g bullets for deer and with a center fire rifle, and that seems to be a favorable tradeoff between speed and meat damage. I always aim high behind the shoulder to save meat regardless of caliber. I definitely favor the 25-06 for putting deer down fast but you have to respect the good old 30-06 with any bullet.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ontario Honker Hunter
    replied
    Originally posted by DakotaMan View Post
    A 30-06 will damage meat.
    Not so much in 180 gr. Sure those hot long distance lighter weight bullets can make a mess in 30-06, especially if something pops up close range. Stick to sensible range (especially for a newcomer) of less than 200 yards and 180 gr CoreLok 30-06 will not tear up a deer.

    Leave a comment:


  • Milldawg
    replied
    Hornady sst bullets are in my opinion a phenomenal deer bullet. Sadly my 25-06 does not like them.

    Leave a comment:


  • Buckshott00
    replied
    The Deer load in my utility rifle is winchester deer season xp .300wm 150gr. They're blazing fast and fun to shoot. If you're looking for a different load, you might give those a try, but yeah like everyone is saying I grew up on Green and Yellow Box Core-lokts. Hell, I think I was in my late teens before I even knew that other companies made centerfire ammo LOL.

    On my .280Rem (aka My Deer Rifle) I'm shooting 165gr Core-lokts and 140gr fusions. I wish I could get the fusions in 165gr. Feel free to chime in if your mileage varies, but the fusions IMHO perform better than cupped-core at the same bullet weight and load. No worries about what that jacket is doing.

    I'm not a fan of polymer tips in general, but as others have said, we can over complicate things. There's such a thing as "good enough" which is why I use those Deer Season XP loads when hunting deer with my utility rifle

    Leave a comment:


  • fitch270
    replied
    Originally posted by Sarge01 View Post
    A young man (20 years old) has me load his whitetail deer loads. I load 125 grain Nosler ballistic tips and he says they are the best deer load that he ever shot. He was shooting 150 grain Core Locks before this.
    Nosler Ballistic tips come in two styles, one for varmints and one for big game. The Ballistic Tip name gives the impression that they blow up, and the varmint style do, but the big game version was beefed up years ago to where something like 65% of the bullet weight is the jacket.

    Leave a comment:


  • fitch270
    replied
    I'm going to echo Dakotaman's first sentence. Honestly, deer hunters overthink this stuff way too much at times. The one thing about cup and core bullets is that occasionally you'll get one that marches to it's own drummer.

    Two years ago my kid killed his first buck at about 20 yards with a Hornady American whitetail 139gr 7mm-08 round. I'd bought them based on numerous reports of them being tough for that style bullet. It was probably the close range but the bullet blew up on impact quartering in just behind the ribs, I found the empty jacket under the scapula on the far side with no exit. It wasn't the performance I'd hoped for but still resulted in a very dead deer in about 40 yards.



    OHH; I believe the ammo you referred to were Winchester's similarly named Deer Season XP line. They have an exaggerated plastic tip that fills what amounts to a huge hollow point.

    Leave a comment:

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