Top Ad

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Winchester deer season. .223 any experience.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Winchester deer season. .223 any experience.

    Son in law wants to use his ar-15 for deer season. He bought the deer season ammo any experience anyone. I offered him my back up 25-06 rem 700 with vx3i but he wants to use his rifle. I think he’s going to find a 400 dollars ar and a Chineseum Amazon scope is going to be a lacking combination. Anyways he will learn the hard way.

  • #2
    I've only used the 308 WDS xp but I'm pretty interested in how the 223 version performs if he gets a crack at one so please post back if he gets a shot(s). Bought the copper impact version for my 6.5 C pistol and if I get a crack at one I will report back. It would be the end of December before I get that chance though.

    Comment


    • #3
      I've never shot a deer with a 5.56/.223.
      Our military people have slain grown men across quite a bit of the globe, so I have no doubt the cartridge IS capable of killing a deer.
      'dawg, I know you know this, but it's all about bullet placement.
      Put an expanding bullet through a deer's heart and he won't go very far.
      Put a pellet through the lungs and he can go a LONG ways.
      ...but I don't know your s-i-l.
      I've killed deer with AR's.
      A 6.8mm and a .308.
      It ain't the gun, it's the shooter and the bullet.

      Comment


      • #4
        Some of the hunters in our group use the .223. They don't wound and lose deer, but they are good shots and use accurate bolt actions, good scopes, and handloads. 55 gr. NBTs seem to be the preferred load.
        You may have hit the nail on the head about the "400 dollars ar and a Chineseum Amazon scope is going to be a lacking combination......." Try to see that he at least uses good ammo!

        Comment


        • #5
          I've shot several antelope and have seen about 40 other antelope shot with the .223 AR and my brother has shot about a dozen deer with his. I helped my niece shoot one nice buck with a frontal shot at 150 yards. The AR .223 55g Partition bullet hit him dead center in the chest, shattered three big vertebrae and exited just in front of the left flank. The wound channel looked similar to a 150g .308 bullet (bigger than my thumb all the way). Most of the antelope were within 300 yards and the deer within 200 yards. The big buck my niece got dropped in his tracks and never flinched a muscle.

          Most of these were dead on impact but a couple took a second shot when the animal raised its head. Terminal effect was in general, similar to a 30-06 but I have actually seen many run some distance with the 30-06.

          My thoughts
          1. Never use full metal jacket (FMJ) bullets. Most of the .223 horror stories you hear from the military are caused by using this bullet. It will penetrate game completely but leave a wound channel similar to a hypodermic needle. They seldom fall, keep running for miles and few will be recovered.

          2. Never use frangible varmint bullets. They will explode inside a grape and will only leave a flesh wound. I shot an antelope in the neck at 100 yards once because that is all I had one day on a p-dog shoot. It dropped the antelope instantly and it was paralyzed but alive until the second brain shot an instant later. The neck shot penetrated 1/4", barely making it through the hide. The wound was full of what looked like pepper that fell into my hand when I rolled the antelope over. There was absolutely no penetration and I would never shoot any mediym sized game with a frangible bullet again.

          3. Do use a premium hunting bullet like a Combined Technology, Nosler Partition, Hornady ELD-X. Do not worry about using a heavy long range bullet because hunting with a 9 twist .223 is NOT long range business. Plan on 300 yards or less and a flat based bullet is fine. My preference is a 55g bullet. I am of the opinion that the velocity of the smaller bullets has high shock value. However, there are those who shoot heavier hunting bullets just fine. The velocity of the smaller bullets also helps me be quite predictable with running shots. If you shoot a big bullet, I suggest you get the deer to stand still first.

          4. The .223 is too light and too fast to be a brush gun. Make sure there is nothing but daylight on the bullet's path.

          The .223 is deadly within reasonable white tail range. Don't worry about it.
          Last edited by DakotaMan; 10-19-2021, 04:54 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            .223 can kill a deer. Wait for optimum shot angle. I woild prefer an angling away shot target. That is just me.

            Comment


            • #7
              First question is has he shot it for accuracy yet?

              Winchester’s site shows per the back of the box as that loading being a 64gr bullet for 1-7 to 1-9 twist barrels, could be an issue if his isn’t twisted right.


              Click image for larger version

Name:	EE55B32F-90E0-4A41-8191-C197C42E2417.jpeg
Views:	136
Size:	227.8 KB
ID:	783291

              The box also says it’s intended for deer.


              In general the Deer Season bullets have a large polymer tip that causes them to open fast, they have a reputation for causing lots of meat damage.


              If the gun shoots them well and he stays behind the shoulder I would imagine they’ll do fine.



              Somewhat related, last week a guy was telling a few of us how his 14year old daughter had killed a doe that morning with her .223. Youth season deal. Someone asked him what ammo she used and he didn’t know but he had it in his truck. He came back with a box of Wolf FMJ. She’d punched the deer through the heart fortunately. Couple of us told him to get different ammo and why, he nodded like he understood but I can’t help but wonder if he thought we were being idiots.

              The girl took her Hunter Ed class last year completely online. Dad isn’t much of a gun guy obviously. Yikes.


              Comment


              • #8
                I think his optics will be the weak link. And I’m sure buck fever will be a player. I offered my competition ar 1-8 twist 3.5 lbs trigger and nice Nikon optic. It will group 1 1/4 with cheap bulk 5.56 and me in a hurry. He wants to use his carbine.
                Last edited by Milldawg; 10-19-2021, 08:42 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Young man who hunted the neighboring farm used a AR15 223 for deer a couple years in a row. He was killed in a tractor accident this past summer so I won’t see him anymore but he was bad with that gun. He wounded a lot of deer killed a few , this is what I learned. Poor shooting was his problem , poor choices in the shots he was taking as well. Sure the 223 with good bullets will kill deer but it does limit the shots you can take . I loaded my son some 60 Nosler partitions for his 22-250 but I don’t have much faith in anything under 100 grains for deer. Milldawg sounds like you have your reservations and I think your thoughts are sound . Just stress on him to pick his shots I think once he sees a opportunity walk away he may take you up on your 25-06 !

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Can’t blame a guy at all for wanting to use his own gear. Sometimes we overthink this stuff too much as well. Hopefully it works out ok, good luck to you.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      If he shoots the deer in the foot, a .375 H&H won't do the job either. I've seen more deer run away unrecovered with a 30-06 than with any other cartridge. I believe that is because so many hunters use them. I also believe that is because a significant percentage of hunters are Bozos. Please don't blame the .223 (like many people do) for a lost deer if he shoots it in the foot or blows its leg off. Bad shots make cripples; good shots make steaks. This holds true if you are deer hunting with anything from a .223 to a 50 BMG. If he can hit a pie plate at 100 yards, he will probably do OK deer hunting with a .223. I personally prefer finer accuracy but it isn't really necessary on a big fat deer.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Agree with all that’s said. His mom and step dad bought 80 acres of woods. He’s going with them. I won’t be around. His parents both hunt. They loose deer almost every year. They shoot 30-06 and I’ve heard him say I can punch a 180 grain core lock length wise thru a deer. Which is true. I’m pretty sure shot choice and placement is not high on the priority list. I suggest once to try 150 grain bullets and you thought I took his wallet.

                        This is the same guy that calls my 25-06 a lady’s rifle. I politely declined the invitation to hunt this year. I also offered him the same deal as the guys I work with. He doesn’t want to shoot for Benjamins.

                        My grandsons are going and I’m almost sick at the thought of them being exposed to that stuff.

                        It looks like next fall I’m going to being spending what ever it cost to get a private lease for my grandsons and myself.

                        I refuse to let them grow up and be village idiots.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by fitch270 View Post
                          Can’t blame a guy at all for wanting to use his own gear. Sometimes we overthink this stuff too much as well. Hopefully it works out ok, good luck to you.
                          Guilty as charged. But I’m also a believer in being prepared and stacking the odds in your favor so long as it’s legal. I also want my son in law to be successful. He’s seen my 25-06 shoot and he’s shoot it and loved it. I would give him my back up but I don’t like him that much. And my wife would stroke out. She doesn’t care for him. He had the audacity to ask me what happens to my guns when I die. I broke his heart when I told him my daughters and grandkids get them then son in laws might get a couple.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I have killed a lot of deer with a .30-'06. I favor heart or shoulder shots, but a shoulder, though a sure knock down, ruins a lot of meat. I've killed a lot of deer with a .25-06, and the only difference I can tell in the knock down or bang-flop, is that I can generally hear the .30 hit, and rarely hear the .25 hit. I can tell by the sound of a bullet hitting whether it hit bone, meat, or solid bone.
                            That being said, this year I moved down to a .22-250. With the 55 gr. Nosler Ballistic tips, every deer and pig went down like they were hit by a ton of bricks. Two of the heart shots ran, but only a short distance.
                            To reiterate much of what has already been written, it ain't the size of the bullet, but where that bullet hits. I hope that the young man will use a good NBT, VMax, or some other suitable bullet, and put it where it counts.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Milldawg View Post
                              Agree with all that’s said. His mom and step dad bought 80 acres of woods. He’s going with them. I won’t be around. His parents both hunt. They loose deer almost every year. They shoot 30-06 and I’ve heard him say I can punch a 180 grain core lock length wise thru a deer. Which is true. I’m pretty sure shot choice and placement is not high on the priority list. I suggest once to try 150 grain bullets and you thought I took his wallet.

                              This is the same guy that calls my 25-06 a lady’s rifle. I politely declined the invitation to hunt this year. I also offered him the same deal as the guys I work with. He doesn’t want to shoot for Benjamins.

                              My grandsons are going and I’m almost sick at the thought of them being exposed to that stuff.

                              It looks like next fall I’m going to being spending what ever it cost to get a private lease for my grandsons and myself.

                              I refuse to let them grow up and be village idiots.
                              I like your style milldawg ! Don’t change a thing!!

                              Comment

                              Welcome!

                              Collapse

                              Welcome to Field and Streams's Answers section. Here you will find hunting, fishing, and survival tips from the editors of Field and Stream, as well as recommendations from readers like yourself.

                              If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ for information on posting and navigating the forums.

                              And don't forget to check out the latest reviews on guns and outdoor gear on fieldandstream.com.

                              Right Rail 1

                              Collapse

                              Top Active Users

                              Collapse

                              There are no top active users.

                              Right Rail 2

                              Collapse

                              Latest Topics

                              Collapse

                              • Reply to Omicron
                                by jhjimbo
                                I have heard the differential diagnosis is based on the mild temp increase up to about 101, not higher.
                                My normal temp is 97, so the 101 rule won't...
                                Today, 01:29 AM
                              • Omicron
                                by jhjimbo
                                Name for new African virus. In Greek means 'we're screwed'.
                                11-26-2021, 02:05 PM
                              • Reply to Wild or Store Bought
                                by FirstBubba
                                I can feel my jaw muscles torquing up now! Man those things are G-U-D "good"!...
                                Yesterday, 10:56 PM
                              • Wild or Store Bought
                                by jhjimbo
                                What is your preference for Turkeys ? I was at a home that cooked both and I have to say the wild turkey was very good. No white meat and very moist...
                                11-24-2021, 10:19 AM
                              • Reply to Books for Christmas
                                by FirstBubba
                                If anyone is a true outdoors "person", any Peter Hathaway Capstick book is a grand read and anything by Gene Hill is good.
                                I'm sure there...
                                Yesterday, 10:47 PM

                              Right Rail 3

                              Collapse

                              Footer Ad

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X