hey i'm thinking about buying a new rifle. a nice one. im willing to pay over 1000 dollars for it. i was wondering if i should b

[Reid Jones]

thanks MLH. i've been looking into the Kimber. but are Winchester rifles as accurate as a Kimber? which is a better gun?

[Del in KS]

Reid,

My Kimber shoots 1.25 inch groups with just about any bullet. While I have not owned the latest version of the mdl 70 I've owned plenty of the rest. They are good serviceable rifles. That said the Win IMS is a little more expensive than a mdl 8400 Kimber. The Kimber is very simular to a CRF mdl 70 in design just better fit, finish and trigger.

[MLH]

Couldn't tell you if a M-70 is going to be as accurate as a Kimber. They claim it has MOA potential but I don't think there is a guarantee. I don't think Kimber has a guarantee, either. Depends on what you consider accurate, too.

With pretty much any gun purchase, especially off the shelf, there will be some variation in accuracy. If you want known accuracy then you'll have to go with the guns that are built/sorted for their accuracy - Vanguard Sub-MOA, Sako, Cooper, etc. Savages are quite accurate because of the way they're put together. The Remington 700 is known for off the shelf accuracy, just no guarantees. My most accurate factory rifles were a Ruger and a Remington (which was tweaked a bit), followed closely by a Browning.

For hunting I'll venture to say most of us are pretty happy with a gun that shoots 1.5" 100 yd groups, though 2.5" is good way out there (remember Clay's MOP discussions?). If we stumble onto a gun that shoots better we are delighted. Some of us fickle guys also handload and tweak the guns to wring out the best accuracy.

I'd be happy with either gun. Kimber has been around long enough for there to be some history. The new M-70 has yet to prove itself but it has everything going for it. These are just my opinions. Be sure to hear out others. They might disagree.

[Christian Emter]

Synthetic. They are lighter and hold up better in rugged country... well if you don't want to scratch up your nice wood stock.

[shane]

Check out the Remington APR (African Plains Rifle) from their custom shop. It comes in plenty of calibers, is perfectly suited to places other than Africa, and has a beautiful laminate wood stock. It looks awesome, and will be stable for accuracy. And it's plenty expensive for you.