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  • Straight Pull

    What do you think of straight pull actions. Savage has one now - any comments?

  • #2
    Here's a few videos showing the action and other features. I'd consider one if in the market for a new rifle.

    In 6.5 Creedmoor of course!







    Comment


    • #3
      This is the first American produced "straight pull" action. We have seen this design in previous European rifles like the M96 and SR30. They are all known for positive improvements in fast cycling capability like no other. Savage is well known for being willing to produce innovative designs and accurate rifles.

      I would certainly like to test this model. My primary concern would be "Can it reliably extract brass that is stuck in the chamber"? Traditional actions like common "Push feeds" and "M98 style" actions both use a "camming" bolt rotation that forces the extraction of a stuck brass to allow it to be easily removed from the chamber. Stuck brass usually manifests itself in two common cases:

      1. High temperature ammo. Temps of over 100 degrees can cause unusually high pressures forcing hot brass to stick in the chamber; especially in the neck area that is not tapered; but cylindrical. If you shoot in hot locations like Africa or on the hot U.S. prairies/desserts, experiencing heat like this is common.

      2. High pressure loads. Factory ammo that has been lawyer approved will normally extract OK. However, it is common for reloaders to incrementally step up propellant charges to locate the maximum charge for their chosen cartridge. This, of course, can produce high pressures and a "sticky extraction" is a sign that you are exceeding maximum load or seating levels and need to back off a bit.

      This action appears to have no camming ability unlike some "straight pull" designs. I would want to test it before counting on it in this regard.

      Other minor concerns that might affect you depending on usage:

      1. I'm not sure what the integral scope rail is. If it is a "zero MOA" rail, it may not work with most scopes for long range shooting. You will have to add aftermarket enhancements to turn it into a long range rifle. If it is a 20 MOA rail, it should work with most scopes out to about 600-1000 yards.

      2. It has an AccuTrigger which is OK for hunting applications but at a minimum trigger pull weight of 2 1/2 pounds is way too heavy for varmint or target shooting applications. Savage does not make a target trigger with a lighter pull and probably never will. It is likely that if this action reaches high production levels, after market trigger makers like Jard or Timney may produce a better trigger for it.

      3. The factory bedding is not supportive of maximum accuracy. It is a polymer stock with no metal pillars and no epoxy surrounding the recoil lug. There is nothing in the bedding to handle barrel torque other than tight action screws. Unfortunately, polymer crushes with tight action screws that could bend the action. The lack of better bedding means that getting a repeatable barrel flex just won't happen. These can, of course be added by the owner if a higher level of precision is required (i.e. target or varmint shooting).

      Overall, this looks like a great hunting action for most uses and it will be even better if it can handle the "stuck case" conditions. At this point I like the fast cycling of the 70 degree bolt throw actions and this would be slightly faster. It is also very supportive of ambidextrous shooting if you need that.
      Last edited by DakotaMan; 08-13-2021, 08:35 AM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by PigHunter View Post
        Here's a few videos showing the action and other features. I'd consider one if in the market for a new rifle.

        In 6.5 Creedmoor of course!







        What do you think of the physics of pushing balls into recessions ? I would want to know the total bearing surface compared to typical turn bolts. I do like the interchangable baarrels.

        Comment


        • #5
          I'm not too worried about it handling pressure. This design has been used in Europe extensively. One of these European rifles does have a safety ball bearing in the rear as well but I've never heard of one blowing up. I'm sure Savage has tested it at far higher pressures than their chambered cartridges can produce. One of these European straight pull implementations does use a rotating bolt face similar to the AR-15 to aid in extraction.

          Comment


          • #6
            It is a great concept, and I hope it it is a success for Savage.
            I don't know how much faster you can realistically cycle the bolt compared to a traditional bolt action rifle. I know some folks that can run a bolt rig scary fast, and stay on target on steel and big game

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Ernie View Post
              It is a great concept, and I hope it it is a success for Savage.
              I don't know how much faster you can realistically cycle the bolt compared to a traditional bolt action rifle. I know some folks that can run a bolt rig scary fast, and stay on target on steel and big game
              When I had a enfield I read a Mk 5 coould shoot faster than a Garand. They used the middle finger for trigger.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by PigHunter

                I have a difficult time believing a MK 5 is faster. I've accidentally slam fired my Garland. Three shots downrange before I could get my finger off the trigger
                True. They went head to head in controlled timers, etc. Plus, the Enfield could stay on target better.
                They took the video down of enfield 8 shots beating grand 8 shots. Copyright infringement.
                here is a good one you can practice.
                m1 Garand bump fire. - YouTube

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by DakotaMan View Post
                  This is the first American produced "straight pull" action. We have seen this design in previous European rifles like the M96 and SR30. They are all known for positive improvements in fast cycling capability like no other. Savage is well known for being willing to produce innovative designs and accurate rifles.

                  I would certainly like to test this model. My primary concern would be "Can it reliably extract brass that is stuck in the chamber"? Traditional actions like common "Push feeds" and "M98 style" actions both use a "camming" bolt rotation that forces the extraction of a stuck brass to allow it to be easily removed from the chamber. Stuck brass usually manifests itself in two common cases:

                  1. High temperature ammo. Temps of over 100 degrees can cause unusually high pressures forcing hot brass to stick in the chamber; especially in the neck area that is not tapered; but cylindrical. If you shoot in hot locations like Africa or on the hot U.S. prairies/desserts, experiencing heat like this is common.

                  2. High pressure loads. Factory ammo that has been lawyer approved will normally extract OK. However, it is common for reloaders to incrementally step up propellant charges to locate the maximum charge for their chosen cartridge. This, of course, can produce high pressures and a "sticky extraction" is a sign that you are exceeding maximum load or seating levels and need to back off a bit.

                  This action appears to have no camming ability unlike some "straight pull" designs. I would want to test it before counting on it in this regard.

                  Other minor concerns that might affect you depending on usage:

                  1. I'm not sure what the integral scope rail is. If it is a "zero MOA" rail, it may not work with most scopes for long range shooting. You will have to add aftermarket enhancements to turn it into a long range rifle. If it is a 20 MOA rail, it should work with most scopes out to about 600-1000 yards.

                  2. It has an AccuTrigger which is OK for hunting applications but at a minimum trigger pull weight of 2 1/2 pounds is way too heavy for varmint or target shooting applications. Savage does not make a target trigger with a lighter pull and probably never will. It is likely that if this action reaches high production levels, after market trigger makers like Jard or Timney may produce a better trigger for it.

                  3. The factory bedding is not supportive of maximum accuracy. It is a polymer stock with no metal pillars and no epoxy surrounding the recoil lug. There is nothing in the bedding to handle barrel torque other than tight action screws. Unfortunately, polymer crushes with tight action screws that could bend the action. The lack of better bedding means that getting a repeatable barrel flex just won't happen. These can, of course be added by the owner if a higher level of precision is required (i.e. target or varmint shooting).

                  Overall, this looks like a great hunting action for most uses and it will be even better if it can handle the "stuck case" conditions. At this point I like the fast cycling of the 70 degree bolt throw actions and this would be slightly faster. It is also very supportive of ambidextrous shooting if you need that.
                  I read the rail was already slanted but I can't remember how much MOA it was.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DakotaMan View Post
                    I'm not too worried about it handling pressure. This design has been used in Europe extensively. One of these European rifles does have a safety ball bearing in the rear as well but I've never heard of one blowing up. I'm sure Savage has tested it at far higher pressures than their chambered cartridges can produce. One of these European straight pull implementations does use a rotating bolt face similar to the AR-15 to aid in extraction.
                    Do other rifles use the ball/recess type action and what does Blasser use ? Who uses the rotating head ?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by jhjimbo View Post

                      True. They went head to head in controlled timers, etc. Plus, the Enfield could stay on target better.
                      They took the video down of enfield 8 shots beating grand 8 shots. Copyright infringement.
                      here is a good one you can practice.
                      m1 Garand bump fire. - YouTube
                      Dang, I hate eating my own words. Found this German video showing the technique you described. Pretty damn fast bolt-action work.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Great move by savage , it has a lot of good features beside the straight pull. This is a savage to keep an eye on !

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by PigHunter View Post
                          Here's a few videos showing the action and other features. I'd consider one if in the market for a new rifle.

                          In 6.5 Creedmoor of course!







                          Thank PH for the video’s .

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I've got two, a Blaser R8 and a Swiss. They are marginally faster when working the action. Blaser had a few issues with the 93, some action failures. As I recall, they were traced back to some questionable practices, but with the interwebs being what it is, who knows. R8 has been good, AFAIK.

                            The fast cycling action is probably near last when considering the merits of these rifles, IMO.

                            Further, if you need a 20 MOA rail on your rifle, you are a piss-poor hunter. Sorry for channeling OHH.

                            With the short stock of the K31, you may do some unlicenced dentistry to your front teeth if worked too vigorously. Not my opinion, this, but a mere fact.
                            Last edited by Amflyer; 08-16-2021, 09:14 PM. Reason: Spell check changes Blaser to Blazer? On a hunting site? Shame.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              All of my rifles and the majority of my specialty pistols have 20 MOA pic rails. I use a sloped rail for a variety of reasons.
                              Channel away.
                              I hunt the way I want...Short, whatever, and at LR sometimes.
                              If it is legal, and you are capable, hunt the way you want.
                              20+ year old bow, public land elk...I was in the mood that year to hunt with a bow.
                              Last edited by Ernie; 08-16-2021, 10:23 PM.

                              Comment

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